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Poster: turnphilup Date: May 13, 2011 7:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

A recent post by Monte called me out, so I thought I would have a little rebuttal in response. He referred to my own old post, in which I linked a article in Vanity Fair, that I had just read and then I linked it in with my own post. Well, if you can follow so far, it had to do with the Dead somewhat, in that I did not get what Bob and Mickey got out of being part of this Bohemian Grove Club thing that they were now members of. What the grove's forester's were getting ready to implement on the surrounding forest in their "grove", sort of sounded like overkill in the name of profits to me and the author, and did not mesh "IMO" with Bob and Mickey's so called "we are stewards of the earth" vibe, which they had previously tried to convey in different ways throughout the years. Any way, the article and comments brought out a bunch of trolls as expected, but also some very good insight by most of the steady posters here. I decided after that mess to just stick to the subject of the what this forum is called and to stay away from the political stuff after that post led us into a ditch. I was a lurker mostly anyway, and just wanted to come here and find those lost jams that I don't seem to be able to get enough of. What the thoughts, intentions, motives, and methods by which the boys live their lives, was not something I wanted to continue to guess at, and then pretend to understand why they would do some of the things they were now into. The four surviving members of the dead were most likely not the people I had imagined in my mind through out the years and I felt life was to short for such uninformed insights to be blathering about here. Monte then wrote after the MIT anniversary post-"On the other hand - I still find it necessary to repeat: GD shows, tours, venues, The Crew, sound equipment, and the tapes thereof, did NOT occur in a vacuum - NOR did they occur in social isolation. A lot of things happened for a lot of reasons."

Well brother Monte may be on to something here with that statement and it got me to re-thinking my position, and I will try to explain why he could be right. Jock Hooper, the man at the center of the grove story, said "The V.F. article played a big role in getting this travesty out there", he also stated " I hope the Bohemian Grove Club has realized that the public all over the country has been galvanized by this terrible plan". So, what has happened, from my view point anyway, is that when the word gets out on a cause, such as this, either right or wrong, say one in which a lot of like minded people get wind of, such as all of us here, it is then extrapolated many more times over then previous eras, because of the means in which we do it in this new socially connected environment that we are all a part of. We created a buzz, be however small, in the hive that reverberated all the way possibly back to the judge who ruled in Jock's and the Sierra Club's favor. I could be wrong, and I know that a lot of you will tell me how I am, but we all know more people now connected to the web then those who are not in this day and age. Maybe this judge had read our post after googling it and gained some new insight to the case then he had not previously. Who's to say? The thing is, we can still, I think, talk and bitch about other issues here that are of importance to us and not let the trolls drive the thread into a ditch. I think we can still make a difference and small impact someplace in the world as deadheads by informing people of what we see as intolerable decisions.


When the National guard fired on and killed four American's in 1970, the dead did what they did best, they just went out and played. Played there asses off.We listened then, and now, on this incredible archive. We are the ones keeping the music and sediments of that time alive. By being part of this new type of "scene", and by calling out those who we think are not righteous and fair in their motives, and by us bringing attention to the injustices around us and to the environment, we can still make a difference. You did not get onto the bus alone, something, somebody, somewhere, whatever it was led you to the stop. A unknown force, whatever it was, led you to the dead and their scene. The "it" factor that you thought you saw reverberating throughout the crowd during a monumental jam could have been it. You keep going back to feel "it" again and again. Most likely, as in my case, it was at shows and during, where you felt so at peace and connected to your fellow man and woman. It was the music and most of the fans, that was our platform then for coming together in one place and to share a unique sense of like minded community. One you could not quite explain in words back then, but one now you can easily type about.

There was nothing like a Grateful Dead show, and now there is nothing really quite like this place! Well, has the bus stopped here for good? Do we get off now and walk around with our heads down? Where do we go from here? How much more information can LIA get to us? How many more C.Miller copies do we need? How many Tigerbolt photo's are still out there? Is this place just a jukebox, or can we write, espouse, and post about the world going on in front of us that does not relate to the Grateful Dead, Or better yet, should we? Should we try and lead people to the bus stop? Will being a deadhead always have a negative connotation associated to it? I will try not to get into the minds of the remaining four as before. Phil says enough to me with his bass. Just like Jerry would not preach to us from his mount on the stage about anything, I don't plan on guessing how they are supposed to be living there own life's today. Like it should be some sort of preconditioned code they should be going by. To each his own, they are in whole different worlds now, then what the sixties led them to believe. But, to all of those of us who were on the bus and now stop by here often, can we have some fun and some back and forth about what we perceive to be true and virtuous ideas outside the context of the forums title? I love the sarcasm, by the way. After all, you never know who might be reading them. Maybe we don't live in a vacuum here after all. WE ARE EVERYWHERE!! .Peace. "When Phil's on, the band is on"


This post was modified by turnphilup on 2011-05-13 14:18:45

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Poster: splue Date: May 12, 2011 7:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

i luv FORMULITES!! they haz less calories

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Poster: wineland Date: May 13, 2011 8:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Is this where we start chanting back and forth "Great Taste!" - "Less Filling!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_zDcQV6_6k&;feature=related

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Poster: ducats Date: May 12, 2011 3:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

huh?

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Poster: bluedevil Date: May 13, 2011 8:32am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

What time does Steve Miller's set start?

Even Richard Nixon had soul.... and he's resting in the "sediments of that time".

This post was modified by bluedevil on 2011-05-13 15:32:45

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: May 13, 2011 8:12am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Ahh, The Bohemian Grove Club. Are you still a Bohemian, even when you are The Man? No new woman allowed thank-you. The last women member died in 1928 [Ina Coolbrith]. I guess you don't make the grade or, ahem, have the right parts.

Let's see. Some of the most powerful men in a number of fields gather once a year. The security is top notch, and there is no press. Among the activities is a neo-Teutonic ritual called, The Cremation of Care. I watched a video of journalistic types driving up to the gate to ask some questions (this was not during 'The Week-end'). Not only did four security guards greet them (one parked behind their car, blocking them), but the PO-lice showed up within five minutes with that trespassing ticket almost filled out.
I could go on, but will not, outside of saying this 'club' has a strong odor of 'droit de seigneur'. I'll leave you with two quotes and the wiki connection (and we all know how accurate wiki is).

"The Bohemian Grove, that I attend from time to time—the Easterners and the others come there—but it is the most faggy goddamn thing you could ever imagine, that San Francisco crowd that goes in there; it's just terrible! I mean I won't shake hands with anybody from San Francisco."—President Richard M. Nixon on the Watergate tapes, Bohemian Club member starting in 1953.

"The Bohemian club! Did you say Bohemian club? That's where all those rich Republicans go up and stand naked against redwood trees right? I've never been to the Bohemian club but you oughta go. It'd be good for you. You'd get some fresh air."—President Bill Clinton to a heckler

Every President since 1923 has been a member.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_Grove

There are many other sources. This is a deep, creepy rabbit hole.

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: May 13, 2011 9:29am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

"the most faggy goddamn thing you could ever imagine"

man, that's some classic nixon right there.

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Poster: dead-head_Monte Date: May 13, 2011 12:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

As far as turnphilip's "rebuttal" goes: He's responding to me thanking him for being a good source and bringing this knowledge into the GD forum.

Re: "The security [at Bohemian Grove] is top notch, and there is no press." -- LMAO!!! That is the funniest thing you ever posted!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_Club#Membership

William Randolph Hearst (April 29, 1863 – August 14, 1951) was an American newspaper magnate and leading newspaper publisher. Hearst Castle is "his" palatial estate on the central California coast.

HearstCastleSlide.jpg

"A number of past membership lists are in public domain, but modern Bohemian Grove club membership lists are private. Some prominent figures have been given honorary membership, such as Richard Nixon and William Randolph Hearst. Members have included some U.S. presidents (usually before they are elected to office), many cabinet officials, and CEOs of large corporations, including major financial institutions. Major military contractors, oil companies, banks (including the Federal Reserve), utilities, and national media have high-ranking officials as club members or guests."
Walter Cronkite and newsmedia's "Old Guard"
"Indeed, the Time organization was noted for sending a corporate plane to the Bohemian gathering every year, according to long-time Grove-watcher Kerry Richardson.

Time Warner is not the only media corporation with Bohemian connections. The list of Fourth Estate bigwigs who have been members or guests is extensive: Franklin Murphy, the former CEO of the Times Mirror corporation; William Randolph Hearst, Jr.; Jack Howard and Charles Scripps of the Scripps-Howard newspaper chain; Tom Johnson, president of CNN and former publisher of the Los Angeles Times.

When Associated Press president Louis Boccardi spoke at one of the Grove's "Lakeside Talks" about kidnapped reporter Terry Anderson (Spy, 11/89), he referred to his audience as men of "power and rank" and "gave them more details than he said he was willing to give his readers."

Walter Cronkite, now on the CBS board, hangs out at the same lodge at Bohemian Grove as George Bush and the former chairs of Procter & Gamble and Bank of America; Cronkite's voice has served as the voice of the Owl of Bohemia, a fixture in the club's mock-druidic rituals.
"
Bill Buckley Jr, Chris Matthews, David Gergen & Today's Press
"The July 2004 Bohemian Grove guest list for the retreat that Herbert Hoover called 'The greatest men's party on earth' was eclectic as ever.

US Secretary of State Colin Powell, US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, former Greatful Dead bandmates, and winemaker Robert Mondavi were all scheduled to attend the 125th Midsummer three week Encampment of the Bohemian Club in San Francisco.

So too, are conservative author Bill Buckley Jr. and television commentator Chris Matthews.

Mandalay Camp is the traditional seat of power in Bohemian Grove. Mandalay is one of 119 camps in the club's 2,800 acre redwood grove east of Monte Rio that over 2,500 men are scheduled to attend.

The camp is so far up the fern covered bank in the canyon that it has its own incline railway to haul firewood and supplies. This year's guest list for Mandalay includes: George Schultz former US Secretary of State, David O' Reilly, chairman Chevron/Texaco, HB Atwater Jr. CEO General Mills and Edgar Kaiser Jr. the founder of the Kaiser Foundation.

Rumsfeld and President George W. Bush are members of the 'Hill Billies' camp although it is unclear if the President of the United States will attend in an election year.

The associations of powerful men made possible by Bohemian Grove Encampment have raised the ire of protestors who charge that captians of industry and govermental officials discuss business matters in secret violating the groves official motto: 'Weaving spiders come not here.'

Of particular interest to observers are the 'Lakeside Talks,' which this year include: An untitled talk by David Gergen, commentator and advisor to Republican and Democratic Presidents. 'The Landscape of American Politics' by NY Times columnist David Brock, and 'The Long War of the 20th Century,' by former CIA director James Woolsey.
"

Note:
- for years, Chris Matthews has been a leading superstar on MSNBC!
- for years, David Gergen has been the #1 superstar commentator on CNN!


This post was modified by dead-head_Monte on 2011-05-13 19:11:55

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Poster: debris_slide Date: May 13, 2011 4:06pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

great post monte...and to add an interesting footnote...here is a great clip of David Gergen getting caught completely off guard by independent journalist Alex Jones...his reaction to the mentioning of the grove is priceless.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8oXGqgwffY

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Poster: dead-head_Monte Date: May 13, 2011 6:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Reviewer: dead-head_Monte - 5.00 out of 5 stars5.00 out of 5 stars5.00 out of 5 stars5.00 out of 5 stars5.00 out of 5 stars - May 13, 2011
Subject: agreed - Alex's piece is priceless!

Cue it up to the 03:18 time into the Alex Jones YouTube clip of David Gergen. That's when David Gergen "reports" to Alex Jones,"I am a happy member of the Bohemian Grove. I like the folks who come there. It's really inappropiate for me to talk about the group beyond that."

some stuff from David Gergen's Web Site

040606_132_t.jpgDavid Gergen is a Senior Political Analyst for CNN and has served as an adviser to four U.S. presidents. He is a professor of public service and the director of the Center for Public Leadership at the Harvard Kennedy School. In 2000, he published the best-selling book, Eyewitness to Power: The Essence of Leadership, Nixon to Clinton.

David Gergen is a frequent contributor on national or international television broadcasts. Since the beginning of 2009, David has appeared on national or international television over 300 times and has been on national radio several dozen other times. In 2008, he appeared on television 170 times. In 2007, he appeared on television 180 times.

• Member, Council on Foreign Relations
• Chair, National Selection Committee for Innovations in American Government

(Is David Gergen a Bobby fan, or a Steve Miller fan? Are they bunk-mates in the same camp during the Bohemain Grove annual gathering?)



This post was modified by dead-head_Monte on 2011-05-14 01:20:14

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: May 13, 2011 7:28pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

What, ya got something against the thought of GW Bush, Rumsfeld, Chris Matthews, David Gergen, and the world's richest and grayest CEOs all standing naked by redwood trees and howling Druidically?

Looking at Monte's list of members, maybe Bob (and Mickey, right?) go as part of a long elaborate plan to dose the lot. They go every year, evil nostalgic plan in mind, and then, at the last minute, sanity returns and they realize what THAT would be like for the world.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: May 12, 2011 10:56pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Wow. That looks like a bottle of Dr. Bronner's Peppermint 18-in-1 Pure Castille All-One-God Soap. Dilute! Dilute with paragraphs! OK!

:-)

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Poster: user unknown Date: May 16, 2011 6:49pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

http://www.beautyofnewyork.com/upload/2010/dr-bronner-18-in-1-hemp-peppermint-pure-castile-soap-8jpg.jpg


It must be the hemp.

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Poster: clementinescaboose Date: May 12, 2011 11:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

lol! that soap is amazing though...

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: May 13, 2011 8:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

yeah, but them folks is crazy nutsos! you ever read the label? don't get me started on saponified oils!

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: May 13, 2011 8:43am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

You have a passionate opinion about saponified oils?!? Now that's a non-GD topic if there ever was one.

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Poster: snow_and_rain Date: May 13, 2011 10:08am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

It's not me, actually, but a friend who is a little nutty about saponified oils. He gets real testy about non-saponified soaps. I remember one time he told me that regular liquid soaps, "kill lagoons."

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Poster: stratocaster Date: May 12, 2011 5:46pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

paragraphs next time please

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Poster: dark.starz Date: May 13, 2011 4:59pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

http://www.vanityfair.com/style/features/2009/05/bohemian-grove200905

I believe what "turnphilup" was referencing are the reports of the Bohemian Club members desecrating and logging old growth redwoods on their land in Sonoma County to the reported tune of 11,000 units of this sacred species over the last century.

Who exactly knows the specific agenda of this high-powered assembly of serious brain trust and financial where-with-all; other than the members?

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Poster: debris_slide Date: May 13, 2011 7:28pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

the grove, along with the annual Bilderberg group meetings are often cited when discussing the formation of a one world government aka the new world order.

Though there is always the claim that there are no nefarious activities that are going on and that the grove is more of an adult male social club...but what bothers people is that..if you have the world's most influential and powerful buisness men, bankers, ceos, lobbyists, political figures are spending time drinking copious amounts of alcohol while attending lectures (playfully referred to as "Lakeside Talks")...what makes us think they aren't discussing policy? The Manhattan project's genesis was reportedly at the grove

Are major policy decisions being made over drunken proclamations of brotherly man love at 4 in the morning?

Probably not, but it begs the question of what else these individuals really have left to talk about for 2 weeks if you take out business or politics.


ps: Here is a montage of Bohemian Grove pictures...many of which were found at an estate sale of a deceased grove member...don't mind the cheesy horror music...the pictures have a very eerie quality to them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URimMtIwDoY

oh...and don't forget your tin foil hat!

This post was modified by debris_slide on 2011-05-14 02:28:46

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: May 13, 2011 7:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Well, then, we can certainly be relieved that Bob Weir will have a hand in world government. Perhaps he'll bring Genius Business Secrets of the Grateful Dead (or whatever that book concept is) to the rest of the world.

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Poster: dark.starz Date: May 12, 2011 4:04pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Good post, very inquisitive.

Weirs interest in hangin out a few weeks a year with the likes of George Shultz to further his political agenda and build stronger ties to Washington, or all the other high-powered artists, business, media, and technology leaders is his own business; though it's safe to say that these connection's further his personal social, global, environmental, and political concerns for which he indeed is deeply passionate. He is not one to waste his influence and is a hard working individual who has earned every penny along the path.

In terms of the Bohemian Grove specifically, i don't have enough first hand information to form an opinion other than to say that several of Weir's closest friends in Marin are very strong enviromentalists as is he.

The Grateful Dead transcended music and became a way of life for many of us out here in Northern California. Just take a look at all the philanthropic work these folks have performed over the years.

Therefore these lifestyle and intellectual issues are very much a part of The Grateful Dead and should be acceptable dialouge here at the Forum. Sometimes it's good to balance out the abundance of music dialouge and speculation with other interesting topics that are an appropriate fit with this wide-sweeping agenda.

When i first arrived here late last fall at the Archive GD Forum, i made the grand mistake of thinking that everyone who appreciates the Grateful Deads music was "like-minded" and that the so called "off topic" subjects such as art, film, politics and world events would share a common interest and mentality. I was horribly mistaken.

BTW, your brother Monte seems like a good man, he is extremely passionate and always has something interesting to showcase.

Let Monte know that when you drive the 101 out of Marin south across the Golden Gate through the City and down the Peninsula towards Palo Alto, just before you arrive in Menlo Park, that original "Ampex" sign from 1959 on the west side of the freeway in front of the new Stanford Medical buildings is still intact and has been preserved as a testimony to the technology innovators of Silicon Valley.

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Poster: Skobud Date: May 13, 2011 8:07am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

"Therefore these lifestyle and intellectual issues are very much a part of The Grateful Dead and should be acceptable dialouge here at the Forum. "

If this is the case Koch, why did you delete all of the political threads from the Pub in one day and start banning? Why do you have a different standard for your own place and this place?

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Poster: Jacky Hughes Date: May 13, 2011 1:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: MY BROTHER MONTE AND ALL FORMULITES

Skobud: I have no axe to grind with you.

Be aware though, you are beginning to sound a bit like that idiot Kochman.

Just saying.
Peace.